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  • #16
    I prefer routers and you prefer lasers, this is a forum and we should be free to our opinions.

    Originally posted by Brad View Post
    Sorry you're offended Silver. You do of course know quite well that we are competitors, you use a router and I use a laser. Recommending a router over a laser when you are in the business competing against my laser is spamming and poor etiquette towards your competitors using a laser in my opinion.
    Grain Surfboards, Otter Surfboards, Chesapeake Light Craft, Clearwood Paddleboards, Sliver Paddleboards, and I am sure many other specialized builders have all chosen to use routers. Some of these specialized companies have been in business for more than 10 years using machines that cost over $240,000 dollars. Your comments about cost, experience, specialization, sound like a sales pitch and quite hypocritical to me.


    Originally posted by Brad View Post
    Without mentioning names I've been corresponding with the larger wood surfboard manufacturers about this forum hoping to get them to participate. One of these companies told me they have a "bad taste in their mouth" about forums because of competitors getting into pissing matches about what is "best".
    It appears to me that you do not really want anybody else to participate.


    Clayton
    http://sliverpaddleboards.com

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    • #17
      All of the companies you listed are using cabinet shop CNC's originally NOT purchased for making surfboards. They all did not "choose" a router. It's what's available to them.
      I did the same thing so did you. Have you ever tried a laser?

      I assure you I DO want other manufactures to participate but you and I are "selling" when we suggest our methods over what a compeditor is doing. It isn't helping attract the good friendly commercial manufacturers to this forum. We need some guidelines do you agree?

      Are you open to deleting all our posts on this thread regarding method recomondations and get involved with making some basic rules? If so I don't need to wait for the other mods to approve deleting our pissing match. If you agree I'll delete our posts here and get you in with the others discussion about what we in the business can and cannot do.

      We would very much value your involvement.

      Let me know
      Brad
      Last edited by Brad; 08-28-2016, 08:36 PM.
      Tucker Surf Supply 714 834 9968 http://www.tuckersurfsupply.com/ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqi...8NubO5rffBde8w

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      • #18
        I just use my jig saw.

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        • #19
          I think censorship goes against the point of an open honest discussion forum. There is no reason to delete this thread in my opinion.

          Originally posted by Brad View Post
          All of the companies you listed are using cabinet shop CNC's originally NOT purchased for making surfboards. They all did not "choose" a router. It's what's available to them.
          You can argue opinion but not facts. Grain Surfboard and Otter Surfboards contract their cutting and could presumably change companies if they preferred a different technology. Laser cutting is not a new technology as the study that I cited was published in 1985. Grain Surfboards has not switched from CNC cutting in over 10 years so it is safe to say they are happy. Clearwood Paddleboards, Sliver Paddleboards & Chesapeake Light Craft own their own routers and do not use cabinet shops as you state. Chesapeake Light Craft bought their first CNC router in 1997 and have even detailed their experiences over that last 19 years here:

          http://www.clcboats.com/life-of-boat...-a-survey.html



          Originally posted by Brad View Post
          Have you ever tried a laser?

          Yes, I prefer a router. Brad, it is fair to say that you prefer lasers and I prefer routers, conversation over.
          Clayton
          http://sliverpaddleboards.com

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          • #20
            OK no problem. if it's over for you that's fine I understand.

            If this forum is truly open including sellers like you and me discussing which is better to potential customers I guess I better put my bid on the table.

            It's a fact Grain's CNC guy did not buy his CNC for surfboards, same with all the other companies mentioned including yours.
            Grain hasn't switched because he has a good business relationship with his guy and as others have suggested CNC is "very good". Certainly a 2nd best to laser and the switch is VERY costly even if it's just switching out a contract cutter. That's a fact.
            CNC is an easier solution because it was all that was available when this all started. Now it's very hard to make the switch but you will see some of your list will make the switch. You may someday too. You can never stop learning and improving.

            Laser cuts cleaner and more accurately. That's a fact.
            So if the fact is that a laser cuts cleaner and more accurately and that the adhesion factor is mute because Router and Laser both need prep why not take "cleaner and more accurate"
            This is what makes Laser better. the accuracy.
            There is no "round" cutter involved. The laser can cut square inside corners. A Router can't.
            No tabs required to hold the pieces on a laser. The end user doesn't have to fix the spots where the tabs were.
            Ultra accurate square inside corners in the notches = tighter joints.
            The laser can engrave layout marks, lettering and numbering of pieces. None of that can be done with a router.

            Tucker Surf Supply 714 834 9968 http://www.tuckersurfsupply.com/ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqi...8NubO5rffBde8w

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            • #21
              Back on topic.

              I for strengths sake would recommend oval holes or stronger yet round holes over following the outside of the ribs parameter. Following the ribs parameter is something that Hollow Board Templatemaker does but it's not right and should be revised.

              Tucker Surf Supply 714 834 9968 http://www.tuckersurfsupply.com/ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqi...8NubO5rffBde8w

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              • #22
                There are two reasons to remove material in plywood frames; to save weight and provide ventilation when you need it. Weight removal, as Brad points out, can certainly be handled different ways in different parts of the board. Also. these structures are so inherently strong that you can get away with even the wrong method most of the time. To offer my two bit on the cnc/laser issue, again, given the nature of the structure we are talking about and the types of shapes we are working with, and the quality of the adhesives most of us use, if the edge is detailed properly the difference in cutting methods doesn't amount to much for adhesion or the end product....each having it's own merits and demerits.
                Randy http://clearwoodpaddleboards.com/
                https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCuW...E0CzWCHvzwiVJQ

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                • #23
                  Perfectly and so respectfully said Randy. You're a stand up guy with incredible talent. I'll do my best to follow suit.

                  p.s Sorry I've been slammed so I'm just getting that sample off today.
                  Cheers
                  Brad
                  Tucker Surf Supply 714 834 9968 http://www.tuckersurfsupply.com/ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqi...8NubO5rffBde8w

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                  • #24
                    Thanks, Brad.
                    Randy http://clearwoodpaddleboards.com/
                    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCuW...E0CzWCHvzwiVJQ

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                    • #25
                      Does anyone know which is the best broker among those listed on this site?
                      https://bestcircularsawreviews.com/

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                      • #26
                        Not sure what you mean by "broker"...if you are meaning those of us that sell frames, everyone associated with this site, in my opinion, does a good job with their products. If it were me, I would look at the offerings and decide based on who sells the board I want to build.
                        Randy http://clearwoodpaddleboards.com/
                        https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCuW...E0CzWCHvzwiVJQ

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